Another school shooting ??

[Asshole]

http://news.uk.msn.com/Article.aspx?cp-documentid=7543851

whats that i see headed this way!?!? Its a new gun control thread!!

Two of those were left in a critical condition in what was the fourth US school shooting within a week.

[Sir Brian]

leave um to it, so long as the psychopaths dont cross the Atalantic i dont give a flying f***.

Americans bring it all on themselves, "right to carry arms" and all that redneck bollox.

:hehe:

[6m$SexGod]

The biggest problem for American Schools is that guns are banned there! If the guns were not banned then people would not go into school and start shooting people because they would get shot back!

Just my 2cents worth!

It is becoming a joke though. Ban guns in USandA!

[steff]

The biggest problem for American Schools is that guns are banned there!


What - the - fuck...

[Calienta]

The biggest problem for American Schools is that guns are banned there! If the guns were not banned then people would not go into school and start shooting people because they would get shot back!

Just my 2cents worth!

It is becoming a joke though. Ban guns in USandA!

WOWWW ... Are you suggesting kids be allowed to bring guns to school?!?

Then all the measly little arguments would turn into deaths because some stupid ass kid would pull out his .22 and 'bust a cap in yo ass' .

[Puppy Dogs and Ice Cream]

http://news.uk.msn.com/Article.aspx?cp-documentid=7543851

whats that i see headed this way!?!? Its a new gun control thread!!

Two of those were left in a critical condition in what was the fourth US school shooting within a week.

yep that school isnt far from me either.

[Quaker]

The biggest problem for American Schools is that guns are banned there! If the guns were not banned then people would not go into school and start shooting people because they would get shot back!

Yes because that tactic has worked wonders in other areas, specifically states with the death penalty...

I wonder when we'll finally put in place some sort of preventative programs rather than always waiting for something to happen and then pretending like we care. And no handing everyone guns is not a tool to prevent something as that person will just find another way to harm people the next day.

We need long term programs that are implemented all through out K-12, these people don't just wake up one day and decide to do this shit... there are signs that people ignore.

The one key link between almost all shooters to date has been some sort of bullying in school.

In three fourths of the cases studied for the "Interim Report on the Prevention of Targeted Violence in Schools" (www.ed.gov/offices/oese/sdfs), student shooters reacted violently to being bullied by fellow students, researchers found.

The common wisdom that school shooters just "snap" was found to be inaccurate. In fact, researchers found that in 75 percent of the cases students planned the attack ahead of time, and in virtually all cases they told a peer or sibling about their intention to kill. But those entrusted with the information only told an adult in two of the cases.

Preventing violence takes "listening to kids, developing better connections between kids and adults, and developing a culture within the school that allows kids to talk freely and openly about things that are bothering them," said Bill Modzeleski, one of the authors of the report and head of the DOE's Safe And Drug-Free Schools Program.

Link (http://www.stateline.org/live/ViewPage.action?siteNodeId=136&languageId=1&contentId=14154)

[Asshole]

Maybe its me being stupid but i think 6million $ man was poking fun at the americans usual argument of "i wont get robbed if they think i have a gun"

[Dymond]

OK.. so I admit I've thought heavier gun controls would fix this issue but tell me about Canada's gun laws? Are they any better or worse than the USA's? Because you don't hear alot about people in Canada shooting up schools.

[Calienta]

We have strict gun laws but there are still LOADS of guns here. You are allowed to have a gun but it must be registered. It's like I said before in another thread though - it's the mentality. We don't believe we need to be packing everywhere we go, and we also feel safe roaming the worst streets in the city because we know that it's extremely unlikely that someone is going to attack you, or if they do attack, that they will have a gun. That's not because they're illegal, but because as a nation we don't get guns to protect ourselves really, and so the 'bad guys' don't seem to feel the need to have a gun either.

[Puppy Dogs and Ice Cream]

dont matter what laws you pass or what education people get or how there raised, they want to shoot up a school they will do it.. its the new way of commiting suicide.. the in thing to do

[hoos]

dont matter what laws you pass or what education people get or how there raised, they want to shoot up a school they will do it.. its the new way of commiting suicide.. the in thing to do


^^winner^^

That's the thing about the gun debate. Banning guns, or allowing students to carry concealed weapons on campus is not going to affect school shootings. If a person wants to do it, they will.

[Dymond]

Yeah your laws don't sound any looser or stricter than ours.. So its not the guns but our mentality about the guns thats the problem.. Do we blame violence in video games? the internet.. what makes the US so bad about taking out their anger and frustration out on other people with weapons?

[the squid of despair]

The media has glorified these kinds of things.

[Calienta]

Dave it's not the video games or the movies. We have all the same ones.

I think it's the media. Our media doesn't whip us into a frenzy talking about this shooting and that danger and all that shit. We just aren't living in a society where we think everybody is dangerous.

[Lord Temujin]

Or the media does too good a job of whipping us into a fury..

thus we get people who want that kind of attention(because for whatever reason they dont get it at home/school) and then they just..follow the leader..go out and shoot up the school

True..they might die..but everyone will like them then right?

[Puppy Dogs and Ice Cream]

very sad isnt it

[6m$SexGod]

I wasnt poking fun at americans asshole(just your name, not trying to offend you) lol

I just heard it on the radio and it made sense, things like this can really happen in a school, due to the laws being so tight about guns. Stupid i know, but made me think!

I did not mean for every kid to have guns in school, because i know what would happen...but am saying that something needs to be done about this as its getting out of hand, all of these killings!

*tries to back out of the convo without anybody noticing*

[Colonel Sanders]

It happens in the United States more so than Canada or anywhere else with lax gun laws because we treat our youth worse.

Schools are some of the worst of any nation, parents and how the raise is the worst..the list goes on. It also doesn't help that the media glorifies all of it. If some whacked up teen sees 3 other people across the country that have shot up schools then that may be the mental trigger they need to go forward with the plan of their own they've thought about doing it. Thus that is why we have 4 in a week.

[Sir Brian]

I wasnt poking fun at americans asshole(just your name, not trying to offend you) lol

I just heard it on the radio and it made sense, things like this can really happen in a school, due to the laws being so tight about guns. Stupid i know, but made me think!

I did not mean for every kid to have guns in school, because i know what would happen...but am saying that something needs to be done about this as its getting out of hand, all of these killings!

*tries to back out of the convo without anybody noticing*


omfg.
you fuckin idiotic yanks are actually suggestin that kids are allowed to take guns into school.

just think about it for a mo........

shit im glad i live in Europe. :)

[Asshole]

i think thats the attitude towards guns that got them here in the first place..

shit hes got one, i better get two.. just incase he tries to invade my land..


ooh noes.. the chinese are coming.. better get a third..

OMG.. my kids need guns to shoot those high school killers!!

its going oh so wrong..



Why dont they put a huge % of tax on firearms and ammunition like they do on cigarettes.. that will soon cut down on the amount of guns that are readily availiable for these things..

And why not shut down the gun fairs and ensure that all sales of guns have proper background checks made through the proper authorities.. you should need a minimum age of 21 at least to buy a gun too (am i wrong in thinking its currently 18?) possibly higher.

[Tca]

And why not shut down the gun fairs and ensure that all sales of guns have proper background checks made through the proper authorities.. you should need a minimum age of 21 at least to buy a gun too (am i wrong in thinking its currently 18?) possibly higher.

Here you can only legally buy guns when your 18, have a license and if you have any kind of criminal history (assault, robbery etc) you'll be refused a license. By law, every gun you own, must be registered and secured in a metal gun cabinet thats bolted to something sturdy and the ammunition can't be stored with the weapons.

Pistals etc, carry special laws and you must have a GOOD reason for wanting to buy them, semi automatic and automatics are illegal.

Yanks should adopt something like that.

[Quaker]

Why dont they put a huge % of tax on firearms and ammunition like they do on cigarettes.. that will soon cut down on the amount of guns that are readily availiable for these things..

And why not shut down the gun fairs and ensure that all sales of guns have proper background checks made through the proper authorities.. you should need a minimum age of 21 at least to buy a gun too (am i wrong in thinking its currently 18?) possibly higher.

Okay let us say guns are all banned, what will be done when people start blowing up shit instead of using guns?

Guns are not the problem here. It goes way beyond that.

[Pirate Hooker with Monkey]

It happens in the United States more so than Canada or anywhere else with lax gun laws because we treat our youth worse.

Schools are some of the worst of any nation, parents and how the raise is the worst..the list goes on. It also doesn't help that the media glorifies all of it. If some whacked up teen sees 3 other people across the country that have shot up schools then that may be the mental trigger they need to go forward with the plan of their own they've thought about doing it. Thus that is why we have 4 in a week.


Never thought i'd agree with KAF, but he makes a fair point here. It's time to look deeper into youth culture and understand why kids are soo ostrascized or mentally fragile that it causes them to react in extreme ways.

I hate to say it, but it seems that kids are far more vicous than they ever used to be. It was a big deal when I was in high school to be called a slut or a bitch, now I read some of these kids myspaces and they are verbally attacking each other soo severly that an underdeveloped mind at that age cannot process that someday it will all be history and won't even matter to them. Teenagers live in the moment, as if there is no tomorrow, and if your "best friend" is suddenly telling the whole school (via the internet, which is a whole new form of social ostracisim) that you are a "cum guzzling whore".....then suddenly taking out agression via extreme circumstances seems a legitimate way out.

Anyway....guns are an issue, but adolescent culture has taken a violent and vicous turn for the worst. IMO It is time to start looking at that.


*side note* Welcome back Quaker :)

[Asshole]

Okay let us say guns are all banned, what will be done when people start blowing up shit instead of using guns?

Guns are not the problem here. It goes way beyond that.

Im sure this will be taken as an "attack" on america, and hellraiser will come in heaving ang groaning getting personal etc..

Buts its that mentality that causes these problems..

If we arnt shooting we will be blowing things up...

We dont have guns here, and australia has seemingly strict laws ont hem, canada has tighter laws too.. and in none of those countries is there regular news reports of "blowing shit up"..

I also agree with maija and kaf. but the whole teen mindset is tied into this need to protect yourself against those who are protecting themselves.. its a vicous cycle.

its funny that due to the web this generation of fucked up teens is all over the place.. i dont know if the yanks have heard of gary newlove.. he was a guy kicked to death outside his front door, by yobbish teenagers..

But for american kids guns are so readily to hand theres no point in following the path most other countries do where groups of teenagers find thier own ways to rebel against society... its grab a gun and shoot the bullies.

[the squid of despair]

Here you can only legally buy guns when your 18, have a license and if you have any kind of criminal history (assault, robbery etc) you'll be refused a license. By law, every gun you own, must be registered and secured in a metal gun cabinet thats bolted to something sturdy and the ammunition can't be stored with the weapons.

Pistals etc, carry special laws and you must have a GOOD reason for wanting to buy them, semi automatic and automatics are illegal.

Yanks should adopt something like that.

Sounds almost exactly like California. I just don't think there's a law requireing it to be secure inside of a bolted down safe.

[Mikey:)]

We just used to fire elastic bands and paper balls at each other in my day... I suppose thats just not cool anymore :(

[Asshole]

we fired paperclips using elastic bands.. look how things escalate!

[hoos]

we fired paperclips using elastic bands.. look how things escalate!

Elastic bands? you mean rubber bands? lol potato--http://www.joker-bikes.de/tim/egghunt/eggs/9b458da40.46 (http://www.joker-bikes.de/tim/egghunt/egg.php?id=46&key=9b458da40)pototo.

But more to the point. The mentality issue of this whole subject is more to the point. And if you want to talk math for a second. America is ever more populated, with over 300,000,000 people. With an increasing population you have an increase in people interested in math, or interested in animals. You also have an increase of crazy people popping up.

Just another factor and my .02 to be thrown in. IMO this topic is like beating a dead horse for the 15th time.

[Tca]

With an increasing population you have an increase in people interested in math, or interested in animals. You also have an increase of crazy people popping up.
.

I wanted to highlight this point, was reading the paper today and they said (and this is an australian newspaper, knowing our news, they probably have shit completey fucked up) but apparantly the guy had an unstable past, had been in a mental hospital after he stopped taking medication and in the past few years, had developed an obsession with guns. If those don't sound like alarm bells for locking someone in a mental hospital, i don't know what is?

[HellRaiser]

Not the gun debate again lol.

Im sure this will be taken as an "attack" on america, and hellraiser will come in heaving ang groaning getting personal etc..


Nope, because you and gun lobbyists like you have no true understanding of the heart of the matter.
A few here that have posted clearly see the light of the deeper social emotional problem as the "CAUSE".
So to argue with you or those that have that train of thought its just continous pounding of the head against a wall lol.

In the end, I don't know how many times I or Calienta can keep saying,
Canada as the example that DELFATES YOU'S CLAIMS as a system that works and apparently more stable society.

[hoos]

I wanted to highlight this point, was reading the paper today and they said (and this is an australian newspaper, knowing our news, they probably have shit completey fucked up) but apparantly the guy had an unstable past, had been in a mental hospital after he stopped taking medication and in the past few years, had developed an obsession with guns. If those don't sound like alarm bells for locking someone in a mental hospital, i don't know what is?

hmm I haven't read into it. Heard he was a good student, had gotten some awards that he had done for research. He was on medication that he stopped taking, but no one knew he wasn't taking his meds.

[Quaker]

I wanted to highlight this point, was reading the paper today and they said (and this is an australian newspaper, knowing our news, they probably have shit completey fucked up) but apparantly the guy had an unstable past, had been in a mental hospital after he stopped taking medication and in the past few years, had developed an obsession with guns. If those don't sound like alarm bells for locking someone in a mental hospital, i don't know what is?

eh like hoos said, not sure about the above. He was checked into a clinic for some time after high-school, which would have been almost 10 years ago. I haven't read anything about a fascination with guns, in a recent CNN article it mentioned him telling his GF he bought two guns for "home protection".

That above-mentioned interview also touched on a lot of other things which go against the norm for someone who is about to end his life and/or a school shooter. He had just recently signed up for the LSAT's amongst other long-term things. Also the GF didn't agree with the "he's been off meds and was erratic" line. She said he was just more easily annoyed with little things.

That said, he would have also had to have started planning this, at the very latest, around February 4th (ordered guns) and so that doesn't really fall into the "getting annoyed easily" line. Oh and apparently he sent his GF a gun holster in the mail (received after his death).

There has yet to be one interview where anyone says anything bad/suspicious about him, his professors, co-workers etc. all say he was an amazing person and so again nothing about a 'shady past'.

Last random point, a lot of schools require kids to get psych assessments if they even reference suicide or anything like that before they are allowed to return to school. And so having a psych record is not always an alarm bell, depends really what it was for, treatment received etc.

Hopefully a suicide note or something will be found as this case is really puzzling.

[Shanna]

they were trying to pass a law so that teachers could have weapons in school..i think with all the shootings.. they might just pass it..then u will have teachers killing the kids. and kids killing eachother..

[Calienta]

they were trying to pass a law so that teachers could have weapons in school..i think will all the shootings.. they might just pass it..then u will have teachers killing the kids. and kids killing eachother..

If the teacher has a gun locked up somewhere in the class, I think it's too risky that a kid will get their hands on it. Unless the teacher is packing everywhere they go (which is risky as well) then it's ridiculous.

[Asshole]

agreed. its just introducing yet more guns into the equation, and thats bad..

And hoos on your point of the increasing population, your countrie in comparison to a lot of other "large" countries has a very small police/population ratio, thats probably another very important factor.


time to start making kids wear kevlar school uniforms in america

or install microchips in thier heads that deploy near lethal amounts of electiricty at the touch of a button.. that would be cool

[Tca]

Alright fair enough, just thought i'd bring it up as i've heard all the same things as you (hoos n quaker) yet can't really work out as to why somebody would fly off the rails like that unless it was just simply a case of "i wanna be remembered".

[Quaker]

agreed. its just introducing yet more guns into the equation, and thats bad.. hah! now that part i agree with you, only in America would people consider the solution to be more guns :-P

[HellRaiser]

install microchips in thier heads that deploy near lethal amounts of electiricty at the touch of a button.. that would be cool

Likes that idea, could contain situations quickly and efficiently. :hehe:

[Asshole]

it would be even more amusing if it was hooked up to a piano..

At least make classical music entertaining..


And yes quaker that was my point, most people would think.. we need to get guns away from these kids.. americans think they need to put more in accessable places

[Jacx]

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/02/20/cnnu.guns/index.html

just extra reading....ugh