Suicide of young people

[Grendel]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/7252732.stm

What drives young people to kill themselves? Particularly in such a small area? :|

[Dymond]

I can't really get a feel for the socio-economic backgrounds of these kids from this article but I remember when I was a teenager there was a study that said rich kids or kids that are well off are 10 times more likely to kill themselves than poor kids. I guess poor kids are more grounded in reality than rich kids.. I mean when your wondering where your next meal is gonna come from, alot of other things become pretty silly in comparison.

[Calienta]

I can't really get a feel for the socio-economic backgrounds of these kids from this article but I remember when I was a teenager there was a study that said rich kids or kids that are well off are 10 times more likely to kill themselves than poor kids. I guess poor kids are more grounded in reality than rich kids.. I mean when your wondering where your next meal is gonna come from, alot of other things become pretty silly in comparison.

Unfortunately the reverse is true in Canada. We have an insanely high number of suicides in our Inuit/First Nations communities and studies have concluded it's due to the hopelessness of their situations. They're poor, they have no hope of ever getting down to a big city where they could find a job, so they drink themselves to death or sniff glue or gasoline ... or any other number of ways.
Suicide rates are five to seven times higher for First Nations youth than for non-Aboriginal youth, and suicide rates among Inuit kids are among the highest in the world, at 11 times the national average.

[Pirate Hooker with Monkey]

Talk about current events.....


There was an article in the NY Times just today about how the suicide rate in the US jumped enormously among middle aged adults last year. While adolescent suicides only increased by 2% on 2007, suicide among adults aged 35-55 increased 31%!

I wonder what is driving this trend?

[Aeon]

Unfortunately the reverse is true in Canada. We have an insanely high number of suicides in our Inuit/First Nations communities and studies have concluded it's due to the hopelessness of their situations. They're poor, they have no hope of ever getting down to a big city where they could find a job, so they drink themselves to death or sniff glue or gasoline ... or any other number of ways.
Suicide rates are five to seven times higher for First Nations youth than for non-Aboriginal youth, and suicide rates among Inuit kids are among the highest in the world, at 11 times the national average.


sorry cali but i have to disagree with the natives in Canada being poor and underprivileged..
I think perhaps you are right about the suicide ratio, but i don't buy that it is because they are poor or/and underprivileged
Almost every native/canadian gets close to $50,000 the day they turn 18.
We infact have some of the richest native communities,... in Canada...
I live in general proximity to a couple different reserves... and the money "we" literally throw at these communities and the lack of care that is put into such beautiful land sometimes disgusts me. I digress..


As for kids committing suicide, i think you can thank the media and hollywood for glamourizing the whole suicide thing...
Granted some actually do such things out of desperation..

Think of the virigin suicides for example...

[Dymond]

I'm not sure what its like up North but I don't think the Native Americans ever really recovered from being put on reservations, but we are digressing from the point. I think the media romanticizing suicide isn't helping matters either..

[Aeon]

Also there is a technical term for "the suicide domino" effect...
Like janie kills herself.... janie's death attracts attention
julie kills herself ... to get attention
so on and so on...
Ofcourse i sorta believe that one who kills themselves is expressing
a more parricidal (sp) intent over a suicidal tendancy...
(i think that makes sence...)

here's something i found...


Splitting And The Psychodynamics Of Adolescent And Young Adult Suicide Attempts
Henri Chabrol and Henri Sztulman </SPAN>

The authors point to a link between the contradictory meanings and functions of adolescent and young adult suicide attempts and splitting mechanisms that may explain the normal coexistence of opposite tendencies. They argue that suicide attempts of young people reveal a deadlock in development, in which individuation and the need for dependence are equally intolerable because of the arousal of anxiety linked to persecution or abandonment. The sexualisation of the body and of intimate relationships engenders a risk of psychic decompensation, which is temporarily set aside through the reinforcement of splitting and denial; the suicide attempt, however, is precipitated by conditions that provoke a traumatic return of that which has been split-off and denied. Suicide attempts thus represent an act of compromise, the object of which is to avoid psychic disorganisation through the re-establishment of a precarious equilibrium between antithetical tendencies that splitting can simultaneously address. In particular, suicide may represent an attempt at individuation and flight from incest while at that same time satisfying fusion needs and the realisation of oedipal fantasies. Clinical examples are presented to illustrate the manifestation and the function of splitting in young people's suicide attempts.
[This is a summary or excerpt from the full text of the book or article. The full text of the document is available to subscribers.] ref http://pep.gvpi.net/document.php?id=ijp.078.1199a

[Dymond]

OK so your saying Suicide comes from when someone is feeling polarization from trying to move to more individuality while at the same time dealing with the feelings of wanting to satisfy an oedipal complex?? WOW..

[Aeon]

LOL,... i'm not saying that! entirely...
But to define reasons for different individuals is practically impossible...
just theorizing...

[Quaker]

As for kids committing suicide, i think you can thank the media and hollywood for glamourizing the whole suicide thing...
Granted some actually do such things out of desperation..

Flip that statement around and you'll be right. It's a common misconception that if you talk about suicide than the thought will be implanted into people's minds, therefore, they'll be more likely to do it.

A good video to watch is called "The Bridge" (i think... know the bridge part is right), should be available on Google video (about 20mins long).

A good watch.

Okay I lied, it's 1h30mins long and as a warning they do show some people actually committing suicide so beware if you are going to watch.

People suffer largely unnoticed while the rest of the world goes about its business. This is a documentary exploration of the mythic beauty ... all » of the Golden Gate Bridge, the most popular suicide destination in the world, and those drawn by its call. Steel and his crew filmed the bridge during daylight hours from two separate locations for all of 2004, recording most of the two dozen deaths in that year (and preventing several others). They also taped interviews with friends, families and witnesses, who recount in sorrowful detail stories of struggles with depression, substance abuse and mental illness. Raises questions about suicide, mental illness and civic responsibility as well as the filmmaker's relationship to his fraught and complicated material

[The Last American Cowboy]

Unfortunately the reverse is true in Canada. We have an insanely high number of suicides in our Inuit/First Nations communities and studies have concluded it's due to the hopelessness of their situations. They're poor, they have no hope of ever getting down to a big city where they could find a job, so they drink themselves to death or sniff glue or gasoline ... or any other number of ways.
Suicide rates are five to seven times higher for First Nations youth than for non-Aboriginal youth, and suicide rates among Inuit kids are among the highest in the world, at 11 times the national average.

i hear you, i live about 15 miles from 2 Indian reserves. I've had 2 buddy's blow their heads off with a 12 gage, and those are just my buddy's, 17-18 yr olds.
There has been a number of Indian deaths where i come from.

[Calienta]

sorry cali but i have to disagree with the natives in Canada being poor and underprivileged..
I think perhaps you are right about the suicide ratio, but i don't buy that it is because they are poor or/and underprivileged
Almost every native/canadian gets close to $50,000 the day they turn 18.
We infact have some of the richest native communities,... in Canada...
I live in general proximity to a couple different reserves... and the money "we" literally throw at these communities and the lack of care that is put into such beautiful land sometimes disgusts me. I digress..


As for kids committing suicide, i think you can thank the media and hollywood for glamourizing the whole suicide thing...
Granted some actually do such things out of desperation..

Think of the virigin suicides for example...

Actually when I was posting I wasn't referring to the natives that live near you or me ... I was referring to the Inuits who live way up north, who don't have a hope in hell of getting to a major city or of doing anything else with their life except what they're doing right that second. I don't just believe this for the hell of it .. I have heard interviews with the Inuits and read many articles on the subject. I don't know anything about the natives and why they're more suicidal but the statistics included them so so did I.

re: the $50k ... You can give any amount of money to a person and they can easily blow it. $50k is not that much. I wouldn't be surprised if an 18 year old spent that money on a new car and then was poor again. Not saying all the natives have shit money sense but giving someone money might make them rich for a day, so to speak.

[Tca]

1.) I was referring to the Inuits who live way up north, who don't have a hope in hell of getting to a major city or of doing anything else with their life except what they're doing right that second. I don't just believe this for the hell of it .. I have heard interviews with the Inuits and read many articles on the subject.

1.) Why not?

2.) Yes, because we should believe everything we see, read, hear etc

[kitty]

Talk about current events.....


There was an article in the NY Times just today about how the suicide rate in the US jumped enormously among middle aged adults last year. While adolescent suicides only increased by 2% on 2007, suicide among adults aged 35-55 increased 31%!

I wonder what is driving this trend?



I have to wonder if the increased foreclosures and the fact the bankruptcy filings for individuals is up 75% compared to previous years has anything to do with the increased suicides amongst adults.

[Rev.Alushaun]

i dont hav any links available but ive read about antidepressents and various other medications in things as simple as presciption acne medications that can lead to chemical imbalances influencing suicidial thoughts

[Aeon]

Actually when I was posting I wasn't referring to the natives that live near you or me ... I was referring to the Inuits who live way up north, who don't have a hope in hell of getting to a major city or of doing anything else with their life except what they're doing right that second. I don't just believe this for the hell of it .. I have heard interviews with the Inuits and read many articles on the subject. I don't know anything about the natives and why they're more suicidal but the statistics included them so so did I.

re: the $50k ... You can give any amount of money to a person and they can easily blow it. $50k is not that much. I wouldn't be surprised if an 18 year old spent that money on a new car and then was poor again. Not saying all the natives have shit money sense but giving someone money might make them rich for a day, so to speak.


I totally agree. Less one point...
I don't think people of any race, who are poor.... are any more suicidial than others who maybe considered middle class or wealthy people... the only reason I mention that is because it was one of your first points in this thread and you directly related it to native/canadians...
I'm totally not jumping down your throat. just discussing :)

[HellRaiser]

Why don't we just hit another area and not be so politically correct and call it, as it really is?
This is not about the Inuit, this is about Natives in general....

The majority of Natives blame whitey still to this day for their own dismal situation.
Is it my or anyone else fault they sniff glue or drink themself to death or committ suicide? NOPE.
Is it my or anyone else fault for their own lack of desire to succeed? NOPE.
We all know it's easier to blame others for everything rather then take responsibility for ones own actions or lack thereof.
The reality is, living life and living standards can be changed by anyone if one truly wants to.

The reality is, Natives don't want to adapt, they want to remain archaic but then cry about it...
The reality is, most Natives rather play the sympathy and racist card and get people to feel sorry for them.
The reality is, most Natives don't want to ABIDE by the Country laws or acknowledge the social setting.
The reality is, they DON'T PAY TAX in Canada, wow, my heart bleeds...
They pay nothing into the system, but yet expect Canadians to pay out their hard working tax dollars when it benefits them.
They believe they are justified to riot or baracade whenever they want affecting the public.

You can't live in your world and collect from ours. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
You want recognition and special treatment? Fuck you, pay me...
You want government land transfers? Fuck you pay me...
You want to use our social system when ya want? Fuck you, pay me...

You want to be free and tax free, then don't ask for anything.
But yet, like Aeon said, Natives in general in Canada are treated pretty darn good.

On the same thought, though...

Oddily enough the majority of police daily arrests in Canada are Natives lol. :hehe:
Sorry, no sympathy from me whatsoever...
Maybe if more committed suicide, it would be less burden on the justice system.
So I guess black people have something to cheer about, being outdone, lol. :hehe:

[Calienta]

I totally agree. Less one point...
I don't think people of any race, who are poor.... are any more suicidial than others who maybe considered middle class or wealthy people... the only reason I mention that is because it was one of your first points in this thread and you directly related it to native/canadians...
I'm totally not jumping down your throat. just discussing :)

I know :)

And the only reason I brought up the Native/Inuit card was because that's all I really know about. I don't know the statistics on suicide for any other race/state of wealth, etc ... But since the rate is SO much higher in our Inuit and Native population I thought I'd discuss that.

And Jesse ... That is kind of a dumb statement. How do you know ANYTHING unless you learn it/read about it from trustworthy sources? I will let you in on the Inuits' situation in Canada.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c319/Calienta/Canada.jpg

They are about a $1500 plane fare from a major city in Canada. Then they have to be able to afford first and last month's rent, and find a job that will cover living expenses. Many people who ALREADY live in a major city can't manage this. So imagine yourself with barely any money, and the only way to get out of this rut is to get to a city. It's pretty damn discouraging, isn't it? Not saying it can't be done ... But not everyone is the same and not everyone is optimistic, and may feel like taking their life is the only way out.

[Tca]

And Jesse ... That is kind of a dumb statement. How do you know ANYTHING unless you learn it/read about it from trustworthy sources? I will let you in on the Inuits' situation in Canada.

They are about a $1500 plane fare from a major city in Canada. Then they have to be able to afford first and last month's rent, and find a job that will cover living expenses. Many people who ALREADY live in a major city can't manage this. So imagine yourself with barely any money, and the only way to get out of this rut is to get to a city. It's pretty damn discouraging, isn't it? Not saying it can't be done ... But not everyone is the same and not everyone is optimistic, and may feel like taking their life is the only way out.

See below, for about the third time, the tit makes a good point.


The majority of Natives blame whitey still to this day for their own dismal situation.
Is it my or anyone else fault they sniff glue or drink themself to death or committ suicide? NOPE.
Is it my or anyone else fault for their own lack of desire to succeed? NOPE.
We all know it's easier to blame others for everything rather then take responsibility for ones own actions or lack thereof.
The reality is, living life and living standards can be changed by anyone if one truly wants to.

[HellRaiser]

See below, for about the third time, the tit makes a good point.

You're not aloud to agree with me EVER lol. :grin:

[Tca]

You're not aloud to agree with me EVER lol. :grin:

thats 3 times

and its allowed brother :cheeky:

[Calienta]

Blaming us isn't the point :P There is a very real money factor in their situation that you can't ignore.

[Aeon]

YOu are aware that everyone who lives in that territory/province recieve monthy cheques from our government to live there...

on top of the money you should be earning... and ifyour living in place that costs you 1500 to get out of .. chances are you want to be that far or.. your too stupid to move elsewhere...
On top of that... you can't make it seem that the entire northern population are native... it's just ridiculous to believe that...

and as far as TCA says...
No i don't believe everything i read....
I read, then put into practice through experience...
Have you actually dug your hands in northern soil?
Have you lived amoung a tribe to understand the actual inner workings?

These comments are creating a false idea about Canada.
I have to admit i sorta agree with hellraiser...

However one point...
they kinda had the land first and who are our ancestors to just come and take from them what was there's to begin with?
BUT....we "give" them some of the best lands and they choose to destroy and not take care of it... so the whole comment seems a bit redundant...
but you see my point.

On top of that the white man brought the booze to the tribes so essentially we are responsilble for causing the alcoholism.. lol

[Calienta]

YOu are aware that everyone who lives in that territory/province recieve monthy cheques from our government to live there...

on top of the money you should be earning... and ifyour living in place that costs you 1500 to get out of .. chances are you want to be that far or.. your too stupid to move elsewhere...
On top of that... you can't make it seem that the entire northern population are native... it's just ridiculous to believe that...

Oh don't get me wrong I'm not suggesting everyone up there is Inuit. We were discussing suicidal Inuits so .. That's where they tend to live :P

And yes they get money from the government, but when has 'welfare' or any type of payment of that sort been enough to move a family to somewhere with better prospects unless you have mad money-saving skills and determination? You're right about the airfare being high - I was basing it on an entire family getting out of there. For one person it would probably be only $500 or so to get from Iqaluit to Ottawa, etc.

ALL I was saying is that the future can look very bleak when you are living that kind of life. That's all.

[Aeon]

Agreed :D

[Calienta]

Agreed :D

Cool beans chick :grin:

[HellRaiser]

they kinda had the land first and who are our ancestors to just come and take from them what was there's to begin with?

The one logicial point no one ever seems to ask themself about all this is....

Land in general can only be OWNED if technically one can defend it.
Which is the only reason why borders and Countries and the differences of cultures exist today.
Since the Natives could not defend it, they lost it.
Just like any war or civil war, you have a winner and a loser in the end.
The one who prevails cannot be somehow responsible later for restituition lol.
But yet somehow here in Canada and in the USA, we are obliged, go figure...


BUT....we "give" them some of the best lands and they choose to destroy and not take care of it... so the whole comment seems a bit redundant...

Yes, so true...

On top of that the white man brought the booze to the tribes so essentially we are responsilble for causing the alcoholism.. lol

Well, the "art of war" concept was applied. :hehe:
They gave us furs to keep us warm, somehow thinks they got the better deal lol. :cheeky:
And to think, furs today are majorly frowned upon and booze is still flowing hehehe...