Born gay.

[swiss miss]

ok, so i wondered whether to necropost or start a new thread..... in the end this was my decision!

We have had a few fairly lively debates about homosexuality in this forum over the last few years so here is something else to potentially spark up that debate again.....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7456588.stm

It basically says that gay men and straight womens' brains are of similar size and connected in a similar way in certain parts of the brains architecture. Brain scans showed that the reverse is true correlating straight men and lesbians' brains. The investigators conclude that the differences in brain size and connectivity cannot be a "learned" response but are set within the womb - i.e. you are born straight or gay.

I havent read the scientific paper, i may do if i get chance and come back with my scientists head on....as it is ive just read the BBC article and quoted from there as it was an interesting read this tuesday morning.

[cunexttuesday]

It's interesting. And prob the best argument to the nurture vs nature debate.

I wonder how they would address bi sexuality.

[Canadiana]

Our brains would most likely be equal size for each hemisphere. And there's the proof that no one chooses to be gay. You are either born gay or you're not. Blame your parents, not society or the media.

[Sir Brian]

in my opinion you are born with the identity of either homosexuality or hetrasexuality; however it is the environment within which you develop that stipulates wether you realise your homosexual self...

i.e. (in simpler terms) you may be born gay, but it is the environment in which you develop that will either stifle your homosexuality or lead you to realise your homosexuality.

[Canadiana]

You can grow up thinking you're straight but it comes out in several different ways. Your behavior and relationships is mostly a good way to tell.

[XicemanX]

Our brains would most likely be equal size for each hemisphere. And there's the proof that no one chooses to be gay. You are either born gay or you're not. Blame your parents, not society or the media.

ditto

[e11even]

Similar to this... I did an assignment a few months ago on cognitive differences between the sexes, and came across this: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/01/080103135205.htm Basically, gay men navigate in a similar way to women (i.e. spatial abilities are similar). There are a lot of variations in individuals though - I'm a straight woman, but through various tests have discovered that I have quite a "male brain".

[Timoteo32]

I think it's a combination of both. I don't think it's a column A or column B thing. I think it's a continum (sp?). Like a scale of 1-100. 1 being completely straight and 100 being completely gay. Genetics determine what number you are but I think society plays a role in whether or not you label yourself as straight or gay. 30 years ago, it wasn't accepted and someone might have had to be an 85 before they labeled themselves as "gay". But as it's become more acceptable, maybe people who are 75, now feel comfortable labeling themselves as "gay". I think it's foolish to totally discount society because so much of our sexuality is learned.

I think there are lots of other factors but this is the simplest start and this is already a long post.

[Asshole]

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[Thikpis]

Omg ! a gay gene ? lol


I wonder the mode of inheritance. Is it dominant or recessive.

Do you need to be homozygous for the gene to prefer your own gender?

Is it a mutation at cell division and if so it could hardly be considered an adaptive one as there appears no favour by natural selection.

[Asshole]

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[One Hit]

I think it's a continum (sp?).

Continuum. :)

[Stinger]

I don't have a clue how any studies of these types could be considered valid, insofar as determining sexuality is concerned, specifically as it relates to purely societal gender-based criteria. There are traits and characteristics that we attribute to masculine and feminine behavior, and yet we develop new interests and abilities throughout our lifetime.

My thoughts are that cultures develop societal beliefs about what things make us men and women, what makes us straight, gay, or bi-sexual, and how we handle people that are different from ourselves. We then further make determinations about our own lives and lifestyles by considering our familial belief systems, in combination with whatever is deemed acceptable within our specific cultures.

People vary SOooo much to begin with, I find it odd that we are so obsessed with identifying some "reason" for perfectly natural traits in "human beings". Why do we feel the need to "explain" differences in our beliefs, our genetic compositions, and our "nature" to begin with? Timoteo's comment regarding percentages strikes true to me here.

We all possess percentages of ability within each of these qualities and traits that makes us different one from another. Certain characteristics work better in domestic situations, whereas others tend to make providing food and shelter easier. I think the true percentages are between those simplest of things. Men are accepted as the providers in most cultures, and women the nurturers.

Just because a man has a proclivity towards cooking or cleaning, however, it does not mean he is gay, although society might tend to question him more because of this innate ability. Likewise, a woman that enjoys racing cars or building high rises is not necessarily a lesbian...and yet here again, people will tend to look at her interests as unladylike, and secretly wonder if she prefers women over men.

Sometimes people choose to live a gay lifestyle, as a method of self-preservation... regardless of their natural propensity or preference. Some people live their entire lives AS straight, because of the moral implications of doing otherwise.

As individuals, we "believe" we know ourselves well enough to claim that we belong in one of those aforementioned "categories" to be tested as such. If the test is to determine differences that make us gay or straight, based on percentages of any gender-based factors...shouldn't it matter that those determinants are only societal measures of things we "believe" are either masculine or feminine, in the first place? Shouldn't it, likewise, make a difference when selecting individuals for each "category" to BE tested?

[*~Crisis~*]

ok..

i understand that they say they have proof or whatever..

but how can anyone honetsly say they were born gay??

isnt it a choice that they make..

and how does that go along with bisexuals??
does that mean they were born half gay??

a person chooses to be gay, lesbian, or bisexual..??

[Asshole]

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[Doobz]

i didnt bother reading through all these posts, just the first one... personally i dont give a shit if you were born gay or not. If you are gay, so be it... acceptance. I personally dont think its right, and i disagree with same sex marriage, but my opinion is only my own and i dont judge... so yup thats all

[Asshole]

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[Mitch]

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[Asshole]

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[Alf uckem]

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or was it?

[Pharon]

ok..

i understand that they say they have proof or whatever..

but how can anyone honetsly say they were born gay??

isnt it a choice that they make..
Depends on what you consider "gay" -- is it someone who has homosexual sex? Or is it someone who is attracted to people of the same sex? The former is a choice, the latter is not.

and how does that go along with bisexuals??
does that mean they were born half gay??
As someone said before, I'm of the opinion that people's sexual preferences are on a sliding scale, say 1-100. Some people are 100% homosexual, others 100% heterosexual. But there are also some people that fall in the middle of that scale somewhere.

[Asshole]

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[deadcert]

A colleague pointed out this programme and is keen to watch it, 'The Making of Me' on BBC1 at 9 pm this evening (GMT) for anyone that is interested.

BBC NEWS | Magazine | Why is John Barrowman gay? (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/7523567.stm)

[swiss miss]

A colleague pointed out this programme and is keen to watch it, 'The Making of Me' on BBC1 at 9 pm this evening (GMT) for anyone that is interested.

BBC NEWS | Magazine | Why is John Barrowman gay? (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/7523567.stm)

i saw bits of this in the pub.... intruiging

[Tca]

i still have to ponder, who really cares besides the discriminating people? gay is gay, straight is straight, middle is middle lol

[Phillthy]

How can anyone look at this as scientific evidence?
I quote "compared the size of the brain's halves in 90 adults".
With over 6.5 billion people on this planet, studies on 90 people cannot be regarded as anything but piffle.
I stopped reading the article at that point.

My personal belief is that individuals CHOOSE their sexual preference, it is not predetermined by nature, nurture or their cellmate of the past 5 years.

[Stinger]

Depends on what you consider "gay" -- is it someone who has homosexual sex? Or is it someone who is attracted to people of the same sex? The former is a choice, the latter is not.


In a nutshell.


As someone said before, I'm of the opinion that people's sexual preferences are on a sliding scale, say 1-100. Some people are 100% homosexual, others 100% heterosexual. But there are also some people that fall in the middle of that scale somewhere.

The highlighted "some people" is actually "MOST people" *imho*, and I don't think there is actually anyone in either category mentioned that would score 100%, as most of us have a sort of balance between feminine and masculine energy that would negate any possible perfect scores at either end.